Tier 1 hero max levels seem imbalanced

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alanx
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Re: Tier 1 hero max levels seem imbalanced

Postby alanx » Tue Jan 16, 2018 2:57 am

Shiroe wrote:To raise the hero cap levels, they would have to axe the fact that there's a lower cap (-7) on the suggest range.
(personally, I right now refuse my level 47+ customers more than I refuse my lower customers since I'm busy making some wearables and mastering some stuff, so have more lower level items/Tears in stock than high level items.)

That's the thing, I'm not talking in personal terms here. Personally I outright reject anyone whos capped less than 40 because I've spent two years making wearables already and right now I am focused on primal BPs. This issue isn't about looking through ones personal prism.

Shiroe wrote:As for power, I use the current system's workaround of "weakest gets the good stuff like myth AA gloves, strongest can have that silly Protector shield to buff the weakest further". (since hero level doesn't really mean anything to later game other than power, minor break chance differences @ leg/myth, 3 skill unlocks and suggest range. (don't think I missed anything there))

Sure, but this doesn't always work in revive teams. Also affording multiple myth AA gloves isn't everyones cup of tea. Again, this isn't a personal perspective issue.

Shiroe wrote:A few months back there was a topic about some veterans maybe try to get permission for an alts vs alts competition; it probably wouldn't be too bad for veterans to run an alt for 2-3 weeks every year to get re-acquainted with (current) early/mid game. ;)

This is completely irrelevant and yet again a personal preference of some. I for one, cannot tolerate using alts. I don't have the time, money nor patience required for such pursuits. I just want to play the game with balanced features. I am hopeful that I am not alone in such pursuits.

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Shiroe
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Re: Tier 1 hero max levels seem imbalanced

Postby Shiroe » Tue Jan 16, 2018 4:59 am

alanx wrote:This issue isn't about looking through ones personal prism.

Of course it is. If you say "hey, doing this would be great!", someone else would likely say "that would be horrible for me!" and the other way around. So, then Cloudcade needs to find an inbetween that's likely not great, but meh[1]/OK for both.

alanx wrote:
Shiroe wrote:As for power, I use the current system's workaround of "weakest gets the good stuff like myth AA gloves, strongest can have that silly Protector shield to buff the weakest further". (since hero level doesn't really mean anything to later game other than power, minor break chance differences @ leg/myth, 3 skill unlocks and suggest range. (don't think I missed anything there))

Sure, but this doesn't always work in revive teams.

Well, I didn't really take revive teams into account for power, since you can troll those mostly without per hero power and just let the weakest red-face on horns... ;) (I'm an oddball that doesn't want to run anything worse than a yellow face, so my first Revive team is going to be a nightmare to make; probably need as much Protector/Aura of Protection as I can slot into the few free slots to get close to the 150k hero power after group bonus for the weakest)


[1] not the player
as of 2016-09-11: Player level: 44, City: Eolythes, Blueprints: 517, Mastered: 419, Crafted: 78.61K
(except for tier 1 and some tier 2 artifacts mostly running my shop/gearing self sufficient)

Irgy
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Re: Tier 1 hero max levels seem imbalanced

Postby Irgy » Thu Jan 18, 2018 6:55 pm

+1 to liking it the way it is. Having some heroes start maxing out early means:
  • You can still always sell almost anything that's at least level 18+. This is good for daily quests (though admittedly this could be changed),
    for selling (at a discount) pre-req items that come out low quality, and just generally being able to make and sell lower level items if that's something you want to do.
  • Items level 20+ can still be usefully worn at low break chance and set bonus. This lets a bunch of blueprints and a bunch of random bag/chest/quest items still be actually useful.
  • You get to start making final equipment and permanently 0% break chance items early on, introducing an interesting part of the game sooner and also spreading it out.
  • It presents interesting challenges in making those low max-level heroes useful

Whereas the downside is, well, not even all that clear to me other than offending someone's sense of symmetry?

If anything they should spread the other heroes out (upwards), not compress the existing ones. Which they may do in future updates.

alanx
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Re: Tier 1 hero max levels seem imbalanced

Postby alanx » Fri Jan 19, 2018 3:32 am

Irgy wrote:+1 to liking it the way it is. Having some heroes start maxing out early means:
  • You can still always sell almost anything that's at least level 18+. This is good for daily quests (though admittedly this could be changed),
    for selling (at a discount) pre-req items that come out low quality, and just generally being able to make and sell lower level items if that's something you want to do.
  • Items level 20+ can still be usefully worn at low break chance and set bonus. This lets a bunch of blueprints and a bunch of random bag/chest/quest items still be actually useful.
  • You get to start making final equipment and permanently 0% break chance items early on, introducing an interesting part of the game sooner and also spreading it out.
  • It presents interesting challenges in making those low max-level heroes useful

Whereas the downside is, well, not even all that clear to me other than offending someone's sense of symmetry?

If anything they should spread the other heroes out (upwards), not compress the existing ones. Which they may do in future updates.


1. Yes, the daily quest system is simply based on one algorithm and can be easily changed. In fact for a level50 shop keeper, the current system asks crafting of level18 items sometimes which doesn't make sense. The lower tier heroes seem to be limiting the crating requirements. Even the questing requests are mostly tier 1 90% of the time. They really need to rework the entire daily questing system itself and that's a different issue altogether.
2. This will always be the case subject to the minimum cap. There are several good level8 items that don't enjoy this 20+ perk.
3. Now this reason yeah totally valid and I completely agree on this.
4. This exists no matter what the max level is depending on what style you want to play. Its highly subjective.

I don't intend to offend someone's sense of dispersion or asymmetry either.
The bottom line is that there is some irregularity and there's no way of fixing it from a player POV if they wish to. This issue could be resolved if CC allows the player to choose the unlocking of the level25,30 caps when they feel they no longer enjoy all the benefits listed to support the existing case. This shouldn't impact the current system if they can come up with a way to do it properly.

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Shiroe
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Re: Tier 1 hero max levels seem imbalanced

Postby Shiroe » Fri Jan 19, 2018 6:19 am

Irgy wrote:*You can still always sell almost anything that's at least level 18+. This is good for daily quests (though admittedly this could be changed),

Based on answers at requests to fix the annoying quirk of "proc a daily 'sell' mission, it happened to be that only 1 hero could buy it and he/she accidentally leveled out of range, so now the daily mission is un-finishable", the 'sell' mission dumbly picks an item from 1 (or more) of the heroes' suggest ranges and instead of pulling from -7/+7 range for ex. pulling from -5/+7 would have meant a full rewrite of the 'sell' daily mission code. (so it didn't happen :( )
What that means, is that for the daily it doesn't matter what the hero level caps are, just that higher caps would have more opportunities to trigger that listed quirk and that resulting higher requested items might be more annoying/time consuming to craft/fuse if none are available (for gold) on the tradehouse.
as of 2016-09-11: Player level: 44, City: Eolythes, Blueprints: 517, Mastered: 419, Crafted: 78.61K
(except for tier 1 and some tier 2 artifacts mostly running my shop/gearing self sufficient)


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