SH is in serious need of a revamp

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PiecEMakeR_ZA
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SH is in serious need of a revamp

Postby PiecEMakeR_ZA » Wed Apr 05, 2017 5:34 am

It's sad to see people quit this game left and right, and I wonder if CC has asked themselves the question why?

I am part of TGC (you might remember Dizzle, our mayor's post about the chat system), we were ranked 91 at a certain point with everyone in the city active all the time. We are doing our own raid raffles and always helping others to the best of our abilities.

In the past 2-3 weeks we have had 4 people leave our city, and the game, for good. The reason? They are fed up with the grind, and so are the players that are left. We are talking about paying customers that have bought multiple packages, myself included. I mean, have you ever stopped and wondered how long it will take a player to craft a lvl40+ mythical?

If you don't believe me, analyze this steamchart
You will notice most players enjoyed the first month of the game and then it spiraled into chaos, why? because its a grindfest.

Take the Affection Staff as an example, its been two months and one of our players have been grinding the craft since it released and now only have 2 legendaries. The game is forcing you to constantly do the same thing over and over for months on end to get a single item. Now think how many mythicals do you need to equip all your heroes with? We are getting killed by grinding for weeks on end with no results. I myself have been grinding Valkyrie Grips for a whole month and still don't even have the ability unlocked. 8 Flawless items as a precraft? Are you joking?

I won't even start talking about fusion times, we all now how hellishly unpleasant that system is.

Will this game continue with this trend or will it change?

-PiecE

Tomblade
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Re: SH is in serious need of a revamp

Postby Tomblade » Wed Apr 05, 2017 5:45 am

It is a terrible grindfest for package items, that is certainly true. Not impossible though. I usually don't concentrate on getting skill for package items unless I get lucky a few times. I find it's much easier to try and fuse legendaries with other items I might also want a myth from, or fuse legs with epics. Only problem is that it takes lots of time, and unless you have invested gems into more fusion slots, you end up losing both slots for a very long time.

Sillvestra
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Re: SH is in serious need of a revamp

Postby Sillvestra » Wed Apr 05, 2017 6:05 am

With the new hero pack, I have gone through my hero team setup and re-jigged it to include Prof. Charles in a high power 6 hero team. I've also adjusted the gear I need to craft still to take Healer 2 from the pack ring into account.

With all this in mind, I reckon I'll be taking the next few months of constant fusing to get all the gear made at legendary quality and the teams fully operational. This will give me 4x 6 hero teams running 100% energetic, 90% healer and 8 support and team 5 will be running 3x heroes at 50% energetic (constrained by Fiora and current BPs), 90% healer and 8 support.

Then the real grind begins of a) making Mythical upgrades, b) making Mythicals from packs, and c) unlocking further blueprints from chests for even more fusing...

Another cauldron or fusion time reductions would certainly be a quality of life change...
Mayor of Elysìum (rank 191 Nw)
Lvl 51, 122.1G Nw, 451/559 BPs mastered.
All wood/leather/iron BPs.
17/36 Gold. 3/44 Primal.
0 Magic/Dwarven.

09-05-2017

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akerson
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Re: SH is in serious need of a revamp

Postby akerson » Wed Apr 05, 2017 6:09 am

The graph looks about right for a game like this. My favorite part is the weekend raid spikes of "almost quit but not quite" people B)

I hate to be the bearer of bad news, but people quit mobile games all the time. The problem is we're not cycling in NEW people.
"I believe the forum ban was deserved, as he has been out of line, and warned.

I believe a permanent game ban was out of line."

-Abqu

PiecEMakeR_ZA
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Re: SH is in serious need of a revamp

Postby PiecEMakeR_ZA » Wed Apr 05, 2017 6:59 am

akerson wrote:The graph looks about right for a game like this. My favorite part is the weekend raid spikes of "almost quit but not quite" people B)

I hate to be the bearer of bad news, but people quit mobile games all the time. The problem is we're not cycling in NEW people.


New people won't fix the grind. The point of this thread is to get some transparency on the end-game system. The graph is meant to show people leaving the game.

EDIT: Don't get me wrong, a little grinding isn't a bad thing. It's the fact that we're grinding for weeks on end without any results.

If you design your game with a lifespan of 6 months per user, wouldn't you want your user to experience everything you have to offer? The problem is people are quitting before reaching the end-game.

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akerson
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Re: SH is in serious need of a revamp

Postby akerson » Wed Apr 05, 2017 7:14 am

The game IS a grind. That's the game, it was always the game. It's almost exclusively a solitaire incremental game where you need to set your own goals. I'm not sure what you're asking for. Faster progress? That doesn't change the fact that it's still entirely a grind.
"I believe the forum ban was deserved, as he has been out of line, and warned.

I believe a permanent game ban was out of line."

-Abqu

PiecEMakeR_ZA
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Re: SH is in serious need of a revamp

Postby PiecEMakeR_ZA » Wed Apr 05, 2017 7:26 am

Yes akerson, faster progress. People are quitting because they aren't getting anywhere. They are grinding the SAME item over and over. It's getting in the way of experiencing other parts of the game. By definition, grind = hard dull work.

You might say "so craft something else" but the fact is you can't. You NEED these items in order to progress. You NEED healer items on your teams before even thinking of doing the primal horn quest or if you die you will be punished for two weeks. What kind of a game punishes you for TWO WEEKS and then makes it nearly impossible for you to avoid it.

Its this gap that is making people quit.

Tygari
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Re: SH is in serious need of a revamp

Postby Tygari » Wed Apr 05, 2017 7:31 am

I agree that everything is getting quite grindy.
Many times I feel the addition of the cauldron did more harm than good.

Things I like to see added:
Main Character gain shopkeeper abilities to help in areas players feel the game lags.
Furniture items that augment the speed of the cauldron.
Furniture items that increase cauldron success rate.
Furniture items that increase mastery boost chance.
Crafters that can build furniture.
More furniture upgrades.
More furniture with upgrades.


The Rack of all trades has been one of the best released furniture items ever.
I would like to see more of such items that are upgradable.
Would have been nice to see the magic anvil upgradable.
As well as the dragon and dog pets upgradable.

Cloudcade should also revisit some of this content.
I like to see more animations from the more expensive furniture items.
Like the animals walking around instead of just standing around like statues.

Brutal
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Re: SH is in serious need of a revamp

Postby Brutal » Wed Apr 05, 2017 7:46 am

Ive been playing the game almost a year and have bought all the packages that came out, but even though crafting every day I still don't have mythical level 40+ items, except 2 mythical ocarinas. To turn out level 40+ mythical s can take up to a month each considering I am trying to keep up with new packages and weekly raids, crafting gold producing items like ocarinas to keep buildings activated, trying to pump gold into leveling workers and heroes and keep up with mastering blueprints and unlocking new ones. I don't even try to partake in pvp battles as I don't have time with those. The last 6 tries on blueprints cost me almost 3000gems with mats as reward. That brought me to the brink of quitting the game or taking a backseat and watching the game die. Weve already lost 2 players this month, not low level players as my city is ranked around 70 at the moment. The grinding became too much for them. I can now stop buying new packages and it would still take me a year or 2 to craft the items I can currently work on without unlocking any new blueprints. I now stopped buying the gem fountain as there is no need for new blueprints and the results are so poor that I dont even bother trying.

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WingDingo
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Re: SH is in serious need of a revamp

Postby WingDingo » Wed Apr 05, 2017 9:05 am

The real question is, "if you completed all of the Legendary and Mythical items you want, would you still play?"

The answer for me, and probably a lot of people is, "I would play for a little while, then be done."

Getting the Mythical items is the goal. Why is it the goal? All of the customization and game-breaking-over-powered effects come from having parties with full sets of 10 skills per hero. It's fun to theory-craft and it's fun to see the effects play out progressively as you add each item into your build and replace an old item.

It seems easy to craft Mythical items when you based it on low-level playing experience and look at it without crunching the numbers. Going for low level Epic, Legendary, and Mythical items takes hours. The cauldron time multipliers scale in a mega bad way starting at level 30+ into the half days to multi-days at 40+. Your heroes start gaining levels and your heroes start capping their levels. You're roped in and sucked into the game.

Mythcal items are hyper efficient. They have the lowest break chance, capping at 4% break chance no matter what. They have the most power for their item level. Many items require Mythical to have a skill work. (It's also worth the most amount of gold, but that's rarely a consideration). If it didn't have all 3 of those aspects, it would be a lot easier to balance. If it had a higher break chance, less power, less gold value, and / or some combination of weaker skills, the designers can make them faster to ultimately acquire them.

You can also laterally make Mythical items less of a requirement by buffing other aspects of the game. If you make changes to break chances (lowering them overall), then having low break chances on Mythical items becomes less necessary. If you increase the base power of heroes or add in more non-equipment-based power multipliers, the power gained from Mythical items becomes less relevant. If you offer more ways to acquire party skills / effects than exclusively through items, the need to acquire those Mythical skills will feel like a bonus instead of a requirement.


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